NPP Maps

[rhench]

So, this suggestion is partially to remind myself to do it, partially to see what people want, so feel free to comment/suggest things.

I'd like to see some maps designed by people from our community. As soon as I get around to it, I'm going to learn Hammer and make a basic map, and work my way up to our ultimate goal: a really fucking complicated map.

It will consist of multiple elements (sort of like cranetop): a capture point that unlocks a cart that blows open the intel room, which needs to be taken back to the original base. The first intention is to not make this an offense/defense map, but rather that both teams are on attack. This would mean that there could be 2 carts at the same time, similar to plr_pipeline, or one team trying to cap intel and one still pushing a cart or capping a point, etc.

Obviously this map is going to take freaking forever, and I'll need help not only learning hammer but playtesting and idea-farming for this map. So feel free to chip in.

Also, if you or someone you know has designed a custom map, feel free to mention it and we'll take a look at putting it up.

[.: sora]

You'll definitely want to talk to Carbon. He knows his way around Hammer, and I'm sure has quite a few good ideas about TF2 mapping.

[TheWackyWombat]

I'm trying to learn hammer too... Granted I'm TERRIBLE at it, but I just started and I wouldnt be opposed to helping/giving this a try.

[carbad]

oh hay guys :3

I'm not a hammer expert, but if anyone wants some tips to get started I can certainly walk you through the basics. it's actually pretty easy once you get the hang of it. Doing hybrid game types might take a little thinking though, and you might have to delve into the magical world of custom HUDs and stuff like that.

I'm working on a map meself, as it were. It'll be a five point push style map, a la granary or fastlane. I figured I shouldn't try to reinvent the wheel for my first Hammer experience, so I'm going with a more tried and true game play mode that requires less technical ninjitsu.

[rhench]

Oh believe me, I'm going simple for my first map. Since I'm an Arena junkie, I think I'll start with that. Once that gets done, I'll work on the monstrosity project.

In fact, I think the map should be called, cf_monstrosity (cf = clusterfuck) or ffs_monstrosity (ffs = for fuck's sake)

[Whatsit]

There's three game modes in there, why not call it tri_ for triathlon?

[rhench]

Not a bad idea.

[scrambles]

So I'm a noob at this, but I can't help but be curious. Is this map editor built in, or do I download it somewhere? I've have some map making experience on other games but not tf2.

[carbad]

it's a free download, go to your "tools" tab in steam and there should be a thing called Source SDK somewhere in the list of greyed out things and you can download it from there. once you have it, you can choose hammer at the top of the list to make a map.

for anyone mystified by hammer's millions of little buttons and weird terms, the SDK wiki has a really good tutorial on making a simple map, and it's got all the info you'll ever need for making fully functional TF2 maps:

developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Main_Page
developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Introduction_to_Editing
developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Your_First_Map
developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Team_Fortress_2_Level_Creation

[rhench]

Word was that you were going to run a small introductory session. Any timeframe on that?

[carbad]

AUTOMATIC BAN, I SAID NO SUCH THING.

much srsness later, if people really want me to do a hammer intro thing I'd be groovy with setting up a time and place. Maybe over vent or skype or something.

[rhench]

Vent for voice, IRC for text seems doable. Send me a message with your available times in the next two weeks or so, and I'll get the word out via a poll or something for the best time. How many are you capable of handling for the session?

[carbad]

Kekeke, I feel like such a cool kid :3

Vent sounds good then, and irc for posting links and file paths and stuff. As far as numbers go, I'll take whoevers interested unless we have an absurd number and we need to split it up.

Time wise, evenings are better. Tuesdays and Thursdays I'll probably have matches and scrims with catface, and weekends I often have irl stuff going on, so maybe a Monday or Wednesday.

[Whatsit]

So, wait, how would this work? Everyone loads up hammer separately and you just tell us what to do over vent? That has a huge potential for frustration...

"Click the green circle to open the properties window"
"What green button?"
"The green button next to the handle."
"Wait, which one's the handle again?"
"The little squares on the corners of the box."
"What box? All I see is a list of files."
"Files? Where are you?"
"I don't know. The window says 'insert template' and it's just a list of files."
"How did you even open that? You've got to go through like 3 wizards before that comes up."

etc etc

Can't think of a better solution, though.
Also please note: If the above makes it sound like I've never even opened hammer, there is a very good reason for that.

[TheWackyWombat]

There are tools that allow you to stream your desktop to different web programs... but I cant think of any off the top of my head. Let me take a look and let you know. It might be a better idea.

[dbone]

The new beta of skype allows screen sharing:
www.skype.com/intl/en/download/skype/windows/beta/

[dbone]

Also, from the TF2 blog today:

Today we're releasing an update to the Source SDK that includes the .vmf source files for many of the official TF2 maps. This is something we've wanted to do for a while, especially as we've been growing the range of game modes in TF. Here's the list of maps that are included in the update: Lumberyard, Ravine, Badlands, Dustbowl, Granary, Gravelpit, 2Fort, Badwater, Goldrush, and Hydro.

For the beginner map makers out there, we hope this gives you an easier entry point by allowing you to alter or edit an existing map, as opposed to being forced to start from scratch. For example, you could start by fine-tuning cover in Goldrush, alter the layout of Granary, or tweak the amount of health and ammo in Gravelpit. Or maybe you just have a ton of ideas on how you think you could improve Hydro or 2Fort. We'd love to see what you come up with.

For the experienced map makers, we hope this gives you a variety of examples of how we design and construct levels, the tools we use to finish the aesthetic/thematic elements, and some specific implementation solutions to performance and networking problems. We also hope that it'll reduce the amount of confusion around the game logic and entity setup required for the various TF game modes.

Our plan is to get more of our TF content source out in the SDK, so look for more maps & model sources in the future.

www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2578

[rhench]

I love that they mentioned Hydro and 2Fort. Also, now we can make that modification to 2fort I've been talking about. Awesome.

[carbad]

are you going to put a giant penis in the middle of the map

[Whatsit]

Jun 15, 2009 15:58:06 GMT -5 dbone said:

Also, from the TF2 blog today:

Today we're releasing an update to the Source SDK that includes the .vmf source files for many of the official TF2 maps.

Damn, that's some convenient timing. Coincidence? Or is someone at Valve reading our forums?

Nah, gotta be coincidence.

[TheWackyWombat]

Found what I was looking for: www.ustream.tv/

[carbad]

that could work. I'll do whatever's most convenient for everyone.

maybe this will motivate me to finish a map instead of letting it languish on my hard drive for all eternity

[thechurch]

So.... I am curently working on a map and I was wondering if, when i finish it, any of you would be willing to help me test it? I probably won't be finished for a while, but I just wanted to see if anyone would be interested.

[FadedOasis]

If you have a playable Alpha build, I'll put it on the server.

[phevnil]

I could make some custom props, or something... I need to start some where to teach my self how to export and set things up for source! I won't really know what to make untill the maps are nearing comletion and you have eveything figured out. I don't even know what I would be making, but I can do a bit.

[pneuma08]

I've got an idea for a map that could use cars, lots of cars. But I've been too lazy to pick up Hammer.

[thechurch]

Excellent Faded, ill get the alpha done asap.

Pneuma, mine actualy has a few trucks that act kinda like the trains on well.

[Mad Jack (cervantes)]

Hmm.... This sounds like alot of fun. How complicated is this to pick up? Does anyone have a video I can check out? I will check it out for myself, but I would like to see someone in the process of using it.

[.: sora]

If you're looking for comp feedback, I can probably get VEV to give it a once-over. Of course, I'd still be happy to playtest it myself. Let me know!

[rhench]

We were initially supposed to do a "training day" with carbon or someone. But I'm not entirely sure if that's still supposed to happen. I'd still love to learn Hammer, but I don't have a f'ing clue where to start.